| Interview
A
Glimpse of Taoism with Dr. Ken Gardiner
– interviewed by Instructor Lis
From the East End of London to the ANU in Canberra
In 1992, Dr. Ken
Gardiner retired from the position of Senior Lecturer in Chinese History at the Australian
National University [ANU] where he had begun as Junior Lecturer in 1966. He has had a
fascinating life, starting out in the East End of London in a house "with a wonderful
view of the gasworks".
How does someone travel from those very working class beginnings to become a Doctor of
Oriental History? "Luck" is Ken's answer; being at the right place at the right
time. The Labour Government, when he left school in 1950, made scholarships available to
working class students and Ken was awarded one. He went to the School of Oriental and
African Studies at London University. Here he met a number of renowned scholars who were
to become his teachers, including D.C. Lau and A. C. Graham. But why, I asked, was he
interested in going there? Where had that come from?
Ken's grandfather ran away to be a soldier and ended up fighting in Afghanistan and Burma
during the time of the British Raj. Tales of that fascinating relative, coupled with a
book of Indian stories he had been given as a child, fuelled Ken's enthusiasm to learn
about India. He completed his first degree in Indian History and then, after doing two
years National Service, went back to follow what had now become his real and enduring
love, Chinese history.
Ken told me that what had put him off Indian history was having to study Sanskrit which,
for complexity, is in a class of its own, way beyond Latin. Chinese characters, however,
were another matter altogether, and he discovered he had a very good visual memory and
could learn very quickly. He did his doctoral thesis in Korean history, no-one else in the
West at the time having done any research on the topic. All early East Asian writing was
done in Classical Chinese, that being the language of the educated classes, just as Latin
was in early European history.
Ken gained a scholarship to study in Japan for two years. He returned to England to find
there was not much future for him there in his field, so he went back to Japan to teach
English literature. He received word from one of his former lecturers, then at the ANU,
that a position was available to lecture in Chinese history. Ken jumped at it and has been
in Canberra ever since.
And Now, to Dr. Gardiner's interest in Taoism
When I asked Ken if he could sum up the philosophy of Taoism for me in a sentence, he
thought for a few minutes and then said, "It's tuning into the essence of things; not
getting hung up on the irrelevant." He quickly added, "The best way of
understanding it is through stories."
There are plenty of stories. The earliest known writings on Taoism are basically just
that, stories to illustrate the philosophy. The "Chuang Tzu" translated by one
of Ken's first teachers, A.C Graham, dates from about the fourth century BC. Many people
are familiar with the following story from Chuang Tzu. It relates to Chuang Tzu's comment
when he awoke from a dream of being a butterfly: "He didn't know whether he was
Chuang Tzu who dreamt he was a butterfly or a butterfly who dreamt he was Chuang
Tzu."
The other two main texts of early Taoism are "Lao Tzu", also known as the 'Tao
Te Ching" (the Classic of the Way and its Virtue or Power) translated by another of
Ken's first teachers, D.C Lau and "Lieh Tzu" (trans. A.C. Graham).
Perhaps the best known of the Taoist texts is the "Tao Te Ching". It is the most
translated book in Chinese and with the possible exception of the Bible, the most
translated book in the world. Ken thinks it is probably the most difficult to grasp.
"Tao Te Ching" is a collection of aphorisms
extolling the virtues of simplicity, but each one is bafflingly obscure, lending itself to
numerous interpretations and misinterpretations. Thus, the "Tao Te Ching" has
been used to support many different ruling factions throughout Chinese history.
"He who pursues learning will increase every day;
He who pursues Tao will decrease every day.
He will decrease and continue to decrease,
Till he comes to non-action;
By non-action everything can be done."
This is also explained, "To pursue knowledge is to gain knowledge; to pursue Tao is
to get rid of ignorance. The more one knows the more one has to get rid of. Therefore, to
increase is but to decrease."
Further along the path …
In 1989, Ken was asked to supervise a Tibetan student. He agreed and thus met Lama
Choedak, familiar to many of our students through his series of workshops and courses in
calm abiding meditation. Ken and his wife Merril, through their contact with Lama Choedak,
became interested in Buddhism as a commitment rather than in a purely academic way. They,
like many other Westerners, are attracted by the openness of the philosophy and feel it
offers something that other mainstream religions are missing.
Ken told me that there is an interconnectedness between Buddhism and Taoism as the early
Buddhists, circa 1st century AD, took over many of the Taoist terms as they translated the
Buddhist texts into Chinese. The philosophy of Taoism also became the basis for a Taoist
religion as a number of animistic beliefs and deities became incorporated over time.
Several years ago, Ken gave a series of fascinating talks for the Tai Chi Academy on
Chinese philosophers and the main strands of Classical Chinese thinking. As he explained
then, and again to me recently, the best way of understanding Taoism is through the
stories. He likes people to think. "The Tao that can be expressed is not the eternal
Tao. The name that can be defined is not the unchanging name."
Below is Another Story Ken would like to Share with Us
The Story of the Horse
The King called for his horse master and said, "I want you to find me the best horse
in the world. Money is no object and I don't mind how long it takes you or how far you
travel. I want the best horse in the world."
The horse master replied, "Your majesty, I am an old man now and I don't have the
energy to travel far and wide as you ask, but I have a student who is a very good judge of
horses. If you agree, I will send him."
The king agreed and gave the younger man his instructions, impressing upon him that he
didn't care how long it took or how much it cost, he wanted the best horse in the world.
The man set off and returned after three years saying, "I think I have found what you
wanted. This horse is
the best I have seen. It has a good nature, is intelligent, perfectly formed, strong; I am
sure you will be satisfied. It is in a village quite far from here."
The king was delighted and immediately asked, 'What colour is the horse, is it a mare or a
stallion? What does it look like?'
"I don't know," said the man doubtfully. "Oh, it's a black mare."
The king immediately sent word to the villagers, asking them to sell him their black mare
at a price they could name. Not long after, the king was informed his horse had arrived
and he rushed out to find a white stallion. "What is this? Where is the black
mare?" he cried in anger.
"We don't have a black mare, but we thought this must be the horse you wanted as it
is the best we have," the villagers replied.
The king summoned the old horse master and shouted, "You told me your student was an
excellent judge of horses, but he can't tell a mare from a stallion or black from white.
He told me the best horse was a black mare and look at this."
The horse master replied in astonishment, "Is he as good as that now?"
[For anyone interested in looking at the "Lao Tzu" or other early Chinese wisdom
texts in the original, Dr. Ken Gardiner gives instruction on classical Chinese. For
details, email Dr. Gardiner at merrilac@pcug.org.au.]
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